New member in the UK

Darkdruid · New Member Joined: May 19, 2007 Posts: 8 Location: England

I am new here but have been in love with the XS650 for about 20 years. I have had a Special, a Special II (awaiting rebuild), a hardtail chop and am picking up my 4th XS next week (another Special that has been extensively restored).

I also ride a Triumph Speedmaster and have just sold my winter ride, a Honda Shadow 600 (to fund the new XS!) No matter what else I ride, I always come back to the XS.
Apart from bikes I love rock music, martial arts and horror films.

INXS650 · 650Rider Supporter Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Posts: 645

Nice bike. Trying to make my XS look like a Triumph Thruxton. Probably won't have the power they've got, but it'll be a whole lot cheaper.

ttmaniac · Full Member Joined: Dec 22, 2006 Posts: 468

Won't have the power of the shell bearing triumph? Bump your displacement and compression a bit and watch that triumph die a quick and painful death on the dragstrip. I'm not impressed with the old triumphs and don't think much of the new ones. Triumph has shell bearings like a car. The xs has roller bearings like a piece of industrial equipment. My father in law was ranting about when the xs first appeared how bad he wanted one because the BSA and Triumphs didn't stack up. The xs has the technology. Hemi heads (bi-metal), overhead cam, aggressive rocker arm geometry, etc, etc. Man, alot of people underrate this bike when it really is the bike the british wish they would've built.

INXS650 · 650Rider Supporter Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Posts: 645

Are you telling me with the 840 kit my bike will have the 70 HP that the triumph has? John says it'll blow up with that much power. I like the look of the triumph, not the price though. If I am going to spend that kind of money, I'll get another sport bike.

INXS650 · 650Rider Supporter Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Posts: 645

By the way, I don't have the money for either, the bike or the kit.

ttmaniac · Full Member Joined: Dec 22, 2006 Posts: 468

Screw the 840 kit. I have come to the conclusion that real big overbores aren't the ticket. Mind you, what is the torque rating on the triumph? I don't think the pistons go up and down together like the yamaha. Some shortsighted types rephase these poor engines to run like a triumph which is dumb as hell. They say it cancels vibration. If it ran better or more powerfully I think Yamaha would've built them like that but since the bike is a flattracking champion already there is no need to be stupid.

Want power at reasonable prices? Here is the maniacs solution: Order a 6th size overbore from mikesxs, total cost 160 dollars. Have the cylinder tops milled .020 or so. This along with the overbore is going to bump compression up to 11 to 1 or so. Another way to go about it is to use a copper head gasket instead of milling the cylinder. Cost for milling cylinders about 20-30 bucks. I recommend using a dash of lead additive at these compression rates.

Install 36mm roundslide or flatslide mikuni carbs on shell manifolds preferably. Some guys knock the big 36mm but I know better. If you are seeking maximum top end 34mm carbs wont pull as hard.

I would run points (cheap) or the boyer ignition (blue box). With points I would run dyna coils and a ballast resistor. Although stock coils will work ok under extreme compression I would run something a bit hotter.

If you want more power yet then grab a webcam 59a grind or webcam severe race grind (watch it on this one, severe lift) or shell #1 cam and a set of performance valve springs. I also like to upgrade to the new style tappets that mikesxs carries.

For pipes I would run nothing but straights. When you make power you get noise I don't give two shits about the smartass who says you have to have a bunch of backpressure to get power. Bollocks. Mufflers suck power period. Obviously, I prefer TT pipes.

Now, assuming you did all these mods you are looking at around 500 bucks total cost to send that triumph back to the grave and if you still can't do it then it's the rider not the bike. Mind you, it could cost you more if you WASTE money on the Boyer ignition cause that is what the boyer is. Quality but wasteful. Points can turn redline without missing a tick.

Cut out all unnecessary wiring and bracketry. Remove centerstand, fugly seat, passenger pegs, turn signals, racks, huge battery (replace with small gel), and anything else you can think of dumping. Remember, weight is horsepower. Run stock gears or bump the back sprocket to 36 teeth. Dump the shocks for struts and fill the front forks with 20/50 castrol and you got yourself a drag machine that hooks up and GOES LIKE HELL. Get a sticky back tire then watch your fat-walletted triumph loving goon through the vibration of your rear view.

xsjohn · Posted: May 20, 2007, 10:19 am Post subject: Re: New member in the UK

Heat dissipation is the big problem with any hop up on the XS….Stock head and cylinder temps are marginal to say the least in the summer…..Add another 25 degrees by hopping it up and you are asking for it….You may get away with it for a while but not in the long run......

John

ttmaniac · Full Member Joined: Dec 22, 2006 Posts: 468

I don't think a 680 overbore is going to put out any more heat than a stock motor. Okay, maybe a little but not 25 degrees no way. I know I won't get away with it in the long run but it doesn't matter if you are re-ringing your bike every 5000 miles like any good performance enthusiast.

Yes John and INXS, an oil cooler properly setup would probably be a good idea and give you a bit more performance. Like I always say, run Castrol 20/50 for best performance. Cheaper oils such a havoline, valvoline, penzoil (worst possible), etc, etc are just that, junk oil. Use a good quality oil namely: castrol. It is THE premium oil.

xsjohn · Posted: May 20, 2007, 11:16 am Post subject: Re: New member in the UK

Raising compression raises heat.....Could put an ice pack on it for those summer jaunts to 100 and hopefully back........

John

ttmaniac · Full Member Joined: Dec 22, 2006 Posts: 468

Boring the sleeve makes less material for the heat to have to dissapate through. You've developed an obsession with that oil cooler. You talk as though the bike will explode at any moment in the heat without one when I know its not the case. What oil do you run? Have you lazer thermo'ed different oils in your bike? I'm telling you that cheap substandard oils such as valvoline, havoline, penzoil, and the like will run hotter. It doesn't survive the heat like castrol. I'm challenging you to prove me wrong. The experiment would cost you 20 buck seeing as you already got the lazer thermometer. I could be wrong but I still say castrol is the ticket.

xsjohn · Posted: May 20, 2007, 11:54 am Post subject: Re: New member in the UK

Caster oil is something I use after long trips to ease the ride on the porcelain bus.......No serouisly thats good oil....Have used it....I now mix VR1 20-50 and regular Valvoline 20-50....More zink...Clutch slips a bit for thefirst 30 miles or so then all is ok....Most oils now have almost entirely removed the zink......EPA.....

Cooling the oil is not a new invention but it is a smart one.............

xs750---xs850--xs1100 with safety screen and cover below-70 degrees...
Used walmart letter holder (stationary dept) for the screen and drum plastic covering for the cover...comes in a zillion colors..had some black..

John Underwood

INXS650 · 650Rider Supporter Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Posts: 645

I run standard honda oil in my bikes. Been running it for years in others, and no problems. Now if I can save a few bucks and run the conventional instead of motorcycle oil, let me no otherwise. BTW, the Triumph is of the 360 degree design as well, has 9.2 to 1 compression, is also air cooled, and makes 69HP, and 53 ft/lb of torque. I do have the 36mm on my bike, and they seem like over kill to me. If my bike revved to 9,000, maybe they would be worth it.

xsjohn · Posted: May 20, 2007, 12:10 pm Post subject: Re: New member in the UK

20-50 in the summer seems logical to me......

John Underwood

ttmaniac · Full Member Joined: Dec 22, 2006 Posts: 468

I'm sure I could make close to that thruxton HP level with the 680 bore. Torque-wise I think the XS would destroy it. I could definitely concoct a motor to beat it. I would be running 11 to 1 compression or better. Running a little lead in the gas. More compression makes a bike a bit more tempermental especially hot startups in florida summers which is why I'm gonna try Johns oil cooler idea. Maybe earn a couple more cool running HP with it who knows.

Anyway I read a review on the Thruxton and it gave a 13 second run at 99 mph...not exactly mind blowing. On the 650 motorcycle website a gentleman in one of the earliest pics has a 2nd? overbore and pulled those numbers. So although I like the looks of the Triumph, I am not impressed
by the overall numbers coming from an 865 cc motor.

As far as 36mm being useless untill 9000 rpms I totally disagree. How about all those tests with the 60-80mph roll on times? The big carbs would shine. 34mm's work great I'm sure but I like to beat the s*** outta my bike when I ride it. The Yamaha XS650 is by far and away THE greatest parallel twin ever invented with the exception of maybe that old royal enfield bike with the long stroke motor that they made 3 of. For a dirtbag who wants to burn on a budget the xs is unbeatable.

Has anyone seen the 08 dodge challenger. Chrysler finally got the picture. Now it's time for Yamaha to wake up a produce a xs in 750 form with a few strengthening updates and a bit better gear selection eh, John? Like maybe a 6 speed.

xsjohn · Posted: May 21, 2007, 2:36 am Post subject: Re: New member in the UK

For some reason this gives me a vision of wipping the fur off of all the dogs including their tails in a dog sled race.......

John

INXS650 · 650Rider Supporter Joined: Mar 22, 2007 Posts: 645

I will say this, I do get to ride the 650 like I stole it. I can use 100 percent of the bike. On my previous sport bikes, especially the Busa, maybe 40-50 percent on the street. I would really like the power of the ninja 650. Parrallel twin, 180 degree firing, and over 70 HP! If kawasaki can do it, I think yamaha should do it again. John, will be putting cooler on next weekend, will show pictures, and let you know how it goes. Hopefully I can make it fit.

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